'WTF' moments in Thundercats eps.

Thought there was a thread about this already - but looking through the past few pages, I see no sign of one. So, here goes a new topic...

So, yeah - the topic heading should be obvious enough; the discussion of numerous sequences in any Tcats eps that just made you scratch your head and muter to yourself about what the writers were thinking (and these instances happened in more eps than just 'Circuis Train' and 'Side Swipe' - which were just WTF episodes in their entirety).

Such as...

Totem of Dera - Fuzzy and I were watching it for research purposes and the scene in question involved Lion-O being concerned over how quiet the Mutants had been as of late and Lynx-O giving them info about the area the Mutants were located in - Baleful Swamp.

Two things about this sequence had us just staring dumbly at the screen in disbelief (and we're not referring to Lion-O choosing Wilykit and Snarfer as his companions on this mission).

First of all, Lynx-O. Don;t get us wrong, he's an okay character - but a blind thundercat giving Lion-O the equivalent of a sight seeing walkthrough of a swamp he has never been to or could actually see to begin with makes very little sense. (And before anyone brings up the brailboard factor - when was that thing ever capable of picking up poisonous swamp gases? And if it could, shouldn't Lynx-O be suffering any ill effects from said poisonous/deadly gas?)

The other thing was Lynx-O mentions wearing the Catsuits (you know - Thundercat parkas) for additional protection against the deadly swamp environment.

Okay, three points on this...

- Anyone that's worn a heavty artic parka knows what a great job they do in protecting you for deep snow and frigid temperatures. Swamps, however are generally extremely hot and humid. Just the thought of wearing an artic parka into any swamp environment already makes us want to pass out from heat exhaustion.

- how on earth do snow parkas protect one from the deadly/poisonous gases of a swamp? Inhaling the noxious gases would be the main concern here - and yet, that is the only part of themselves they do not bother to shield.

- If the swamp gases are so very poisonous/deadly - how on earth are the Mutants (no protective wear at all) able to survive wandering about within said deadly gas?


Yes, we're fully aware this is an 80's cartoon; so logic didn't play a huge factor in storytelling. This thread is merely meant for fun.

Chris here...

I agree about the arctic wear that the ThunderCats wear in that episode - it struck me as strange at the time. As for the Mutants, I think the only feasible explanation is that the gas(es) may not have any effect on them due to their differing genetic makeup - bear in mind, we know very little about the climate and enviroment of planet Plun-Darr, the Mutants may have a genetic immunity to some hostile atmospheres? It's all speculation of course, but that's one theory! :)

However, my biggest gripe with that episode is none of the above - my gripe is how the Baleful Swamp, which in that episode is established as being located on Third Earth, can suddenly relocate to New Thundera for the episode "The Book of Omens"?! :)

I love a lot of the season 2/3/4 episodes, but IMO a fair number of them represent a drop in quality of writing... :(

Take care... :)

Someone else using the sword of omens?

I forgot what episode, but I believe it was one of the earlier ones in season one where one of the jungle girls (forgot her name) trapped Tygra and Mumm-ra gave her the sword to summon the others.

I was always baffled by that because I thought the sword was to be used only by Lion-o. I remember when Lion-o and Wily-Kat switched bodies and neither one could use the sowrd unless they held it together, but the jungle woman (forgot her name.. Lol) was able to.

Another Strange moment was when Snarf , held captive in the pyramid, repeated those same words Mumm-ra used for his transformation allowing Snarf to transform into super Snarf.

My thing is, wouldn't the spirts of evil know that that wasn't Mumm-ra? hwy would they allow Snarf to use their power against them or at least to win in a battle with Mumm-ra? I really did not like how that was written. It just seemed like an easy way for the good guys to win. It also belittled the power of hte spirts and made it seem like anyone could do what Snarf did.

Another thing that makes no sense is when the sword is a few feet away and Lion-o deos not call it to him, but instead, struggles to reach for it while a battle is taking place.

Last, why couldn't the sword of omens notify Lion-o that his three thunderian brothers and sister were on an island with Hammerhand?

Re:

Wheee


I gotta listen 70-488 dump - testking.net Too bad people didn't interview Peter Newman as much.

:P lol

I forget the episode, but it begins with Cheetara on a morning jog, when all of the sudden she passes out and the Mutants pick her up. It's like... why the heck did she just pass out from jogging?!

I think I read somewhere that the script called for the Mutants chasing her during her jog, forcing her to run until she collapses in an effort to escape, but that detail was cut from the final episode. But by cutting that out, the sequence makes no sense.

Agreed on that - exactly why she suddenly blacks out is never explained.

Also - how come the Sword Of Omens works for Willa in "The Garden Of Delights", but neither Lion-O nor Wilykat can operate it individually in "The Shifter"?

Good points.

Wakko, I thinnk the episode you're talking about is Pumm-Ra, so i guess mumm-Ra was involved on her passing out of nothing.

The Sword of Omens was written to have some sort of consciousness, even though it was somewhat inconsistent. Like in "Ravage Island" it wouldn't release from the ground for Snarfer or Snarf, but it would for Lynx-O. Its possible that the sword was showing Willa what was happening by giving her Sight Beyond Sight and growing in response to her in "The Garden of Delights" to "play along" with her.

I agree that the Baleful Swamp's relocation is a real WTF? moment. As someone who likes "The Book of Omens", that part always stands out because there is no way for my brain to reconcile it.

Perhaps the biggest WTF moment to me is when Lion-O just heads to Fire Rock Mountain in "Thundercats Ho!" part IV, without ever learning that the Thunderian prisoners were being held there. Again, "Thundercats Ho!" is a favorite of mine, but this plot hole always takes me out of the story. I wonder if it was the victim of poor editing? Shortly before this, Lion-O comes across picture writing, saying, "This is more like it!" but that doesn't seem to go anywhere. Did Leonard Starr intend the pictographs to explain Fire Rock Mountain to Lion-O?

And of course, the very next five-parter brings its own WTF moments. Part V of "Mumm-Ra Lives!" is entirely centered around finding Sky-Tomb to free the slaves. Problem? They never free the slaves. Now, I only caught recently in a repeat viewing that Luna explained they would dump the slaves after Skytomb was fully operational, so we can assume the slaves were let go...but the Thundercats didn't know that.

Also - why is The Forrest of Mists called The Forrest of Mists? I mean...it sounds cool. But its not a forrest, its a rocky cliff-face with some openings. And I guess its a little foggy. I'm wondering, again, if the idea went through some changes but they kept the original name.

"ButterflyBoy, post: 102706, member: 16168" said:

The Sword of Omens was written to have some sort of consciousness, even though it was somewhat inconsistent. Like in "Ravage Island" it wouldn't release from the ground for Snarfer or Snarf, but it would for Lynx-O. Its possible that the sword was showing Willa what was happening by giving her Sight Beyond Sight and growing in response to her in "The Garden of Delights" to "play along" with her.

I agree that the Baleful Swamp's relocation is a real WTF? moment. As someone who likes "The Book of Omens", that part always stands out because there is no way for my brain to reconcile it.

Perhaps the biggest WTF moment to me is when Lion-O just heads to Fire Rock Mountain in "Thundercats Ho!" part IV, without ever learning that the Thunderian prisoners were being held there. Again, "Thundercats Ho!" is a favorite of mine, but this plot hole always takes me out of the story. I wonder if it was the victim of poor editing? Shortly before this, Lion-O comes across picture writing, saying, "This is more like it!" but that doesn't seem to go anywhere. Did Leonard Starr intend the pictographs to explain Fire Rock Mountain to Lion-O?

And of course, the very next five-parter brings its own WTF moments. Part V of "Mumm-Ra Lives!" is entirely centered around finding Sky-Tomb to free the slaves. Problem? They never free the slaves. Now, I only caught recently in a repeat viewing that Luna explained they would dump the slaves after Skytomb was fully operational, so we can assume the slaves were let go...but the Thundercats didn't know that.

Also - why is The Forrest of Mists called The Forrest of Mists? I mean...it sounds cool. But its not a forrest, its a rocky cliff-face with some openings. And I guess its a little foggy. I'm wondering, again, if the idea went through some changes but they kept the original name.

The Sword of Omens becoming a full-on deus ex machina as ThunderCats went on is the biggest offender for me. Sure, the sword is sentient, but it shouldn't have to fix everything.

"Daremonger, post: 102708, member: 25241" said:

The Sword of Omens becoming a full-on deus ex machina as ThunderCats went on is the biggest offender for me. Sure, the sword is sentient, but it shouldn't have to fix everything.

Oh, I know. To be fair, after they got rid of Mumm-Ra's reflection as the deus ex machina to defeat Mumm-Ra from season 1, the sword became the fallback. But it got to the point where it felt like they were never in danger because the sword would just conjure up whatever was needed to save the day. I give props to episodes where it was at least used in a more clever way than "beam of light hits bad guy, bad guy fall down" like "Return to Thundera!" part V where it replaced the lost Gyroscope. But I give higher props when they could find a totally unrelated way to save the day, such as harnessing the sea spire in "Frogman" (I know the sword helped), or even using fire extinguishers to block out mirrors in "Leah". I'm not saying it was always epic, but at least it was original lol.

The being able to breath and survive in space without suits in 'Sword in a Hole' always puzzled me.
Thundera reforming was really odd. Not just the science of it, but in the overall story switching from the far more interesting third earth back to Thundera.
The Lunataks still being alive after all the years they were trapped in the lava.
Also how the precious Treasure of Thundera was left behind and not put on the flag ship. I suppose maybe it had been stolen or lost before the destruction of Thundera.....

"Mark M, post: 102710, member: 5058" said:

The being able to breath and survive in space without suits in 'Sword in a Hole' always puzzled me.
Thundera reforming was really odd. Not just the science of it, but in the overall story switching from the far more interesting third earth back to Thundera.

I'm with ya there, though the breathing in space idea has become something of a trope in kids programming - just look at Power Rangers.
Thundera reforming irks me because they never offered any explanation as to why or how that happened. The idea of them returning to Thundera, I think, was a decent one and am especially satisfied at how "Book of Omens" bookends the series (beginning with Thundera's destruction, ending with its restoration). However, I agree that the execution left Third Earth looking more interesting. I can only guess that the writers had done close to 100 episodes on Third Earth and thought they'd give us a new place to explore. Third Earth ran the risk of getting either stale or ridiculous - after all, how many different locales and radically different environments can we accept are within the Thundercat's relatively limited range? I think they tried to make New Thundera interesting by adding the moons and their effect on the planet. What was missing, though, was different cultures and civilizations. Gone were the Berbils, Wolos, Warrior Maidens, Tuskers, etc. and instead we got an empty planet. Except for some snarfs, who were never terribly interesting (did we ever even see where the Snarfs lived on Thundera?). We can at least be thankful that they didn't go back to Thundera until the very last set of episodes.

"Daremonger, post: 102708, member: 25241" said:

The Sword of Omens becoming a full-on deus ex machina as ThunderCats went on is the biggest offender for me. Sure, the sword is sentient, but it shouldn't have to fix everything.

That always bugged me to no end! Some really great episodes have been pulled down by the ending in which the Sword of Omens fixes everything. I mean would it have been too much to ask the writers to come up with some other way to resolve a problem? Like how the writers did a great job in "Trouble with Time" where the Geyser of Life was used to return Tygra to his normal age. Compare that to the "Crystal Canyon" in which the Sword of Omens acts like a shot of super steroids, bulking up Tygra's muscles in a matter of seconds! ;)

The whole "breathing in space" was definitely one of those moments as well, as pointed out by Mark. And there were a number of plot-holes in various episodes which were kind of hard to overlook, even for a child.

But if you REALLY want to see inanity at its utmost, then look no further than "Exile Isle". William Overgard's episodes were always known to stretch logic beyond belief but this episode takes the cake. Just a few of its highlights include:
1. So many things are shown for the first and only time without any explanation, including a Thunderian Court, Jury and a Thunderian Teleporter.:00
2. Giant Bellows are used by the villains to blow dust from a volcano and cover an entire planet in fog!:confused:
3. An entire planet can be "piloted" by merely firing up a rocket that has crashed onto it.:giggle
4. Lion-O leaving behind the Sword of Omens, fearing that it could be destroyed in a gas explosion, and in a blatant display of self-contradiction, later on himself calling it to him in that dangerous environment.:speechless
5. Lion-O single-handedly defeating the Lunataks using only rock salt, candy and a lie translator!:00
6. A mechanical palm tree with sawing fronds!:confused

"Wilycub, post: 102715, member: 25043" said:

That always bugged me to no end! Some really great episodes have been pulled down by the ending in which the Sword of Omens fixes everything. I mean would it have been too much to ask the writers to come up with some other way to resolve a problem? Like how the writers did a great job in "Trouble with Time" where the Geyser of Life was used to return Tygra to his normal age. Compare that to the "Crystal Canyon" in which the Sword of Omens acts like a shot of super steroids, bulking up Tygra's muscles in a matter of seconds! ;)

The whole "breathing in space" was definitely one of those moments as well, as pointed out by Mark. And there were a number of plot-holes in various episodes which were kind of hard to overlook, even for a child.

But if you REALLY want to see inanity at its utmost, then look no further than "Exile Isle". William Overgard's episodes were always known to stretch logic beyond belief but this episode takes the cake. Just a few of its highlights include:
1. So many things are shown for the first and only time without any explanation, including a Thunderian Court, Jury and a Thunderian Teleporter.:00
2. Giant Bellows are used by the villains to blow dust from a volcano and cover an entire planet in fog!:confused:
3. An entire planet can be "piloted" by merely firing up a rocket that has crashed onto it.:giggle
4. Lion-O leaving behind the Sword of Omens, fearing that it could be destroyed in a gas explosion, and in a blatant display of self-contradiction, later on himself calling it to him in that dangerous environment.:speechless
5. Lion-O single-handedly defeating the Lunataks using only rock salt, candy and a lie translator!:00
6. A mechanical palm tree with sawing fronds!:confused

I really must watch episodes 70-130 again. There are so many crazy things that went on in them and I only seen them one a few years ago. I think next week end will be a Thundercat weekend. :liono
I really liked all the interesting races and environments on Third Earth as ButterflyBoy pointed out. I especially loved the Tuska a Wollow villages. The Warrior Maidens with their village in the trees was cool and reminded me a bit of the Ewoks. :)

"ButterflyBoy, post: 102706, member: 16168" said:

The Sword of Omens was written to have some sort of consciousness, even though it was somewhat inconsistent. Like in "Ravage Island" it wouldn't release from the ground for Snarfer or Snarf, but it would for Lynx-O. Its possible that the sword was showing Willa what was happening by giving her Sight Beyond Sight and growing in response to her in "The Garden of Delights" to "play along" with her.

It's really weird that the sword didn't release for Snarf when it had previously worked for him in "Tight Squeeze".

"LiamABC, post: 102723, member: 25438" said:

It's really weird that the sword didn't release for Snarf when it had previously worked for him in "Tight Squeeze".

That's true.

"LiamABC, post: 102723, member: 25438" said:

It's really weird that the sword didn't release for Snarf when it had previously worked for him in "Tight Squeeze".

You would think it would work for Snarf when it worked, some what, for Willa.

"Mark M, post: 102729, member: 5058" said:

You would think it would work for Snarf when it worked, some what, for Willa.

Ditto, as I've said already on here, Lion-O and Wilykat in "The Shifter". Also there are times the sword seemed to work for Mumm-Ra - in the later series of course . . .

"LiamABC, post: 102737, member: 25438" said:

Ditto, as I've said already on here, Lion-O and Wilykat in "The Shifter". Also there are times the sword seemed to work for Mumm-Ra - in the later series of course . . .

I don't recall the episode The Shifter. It's wasn't one I seen originally and recorded.

It's at the end of season 1, Vultureman's device that makes Snarf and Panthro swap bodies . . .