ROCKS 3B: Superman The Animated Series - Stolen Memories-Speed Demons-Identity Crisis

WELCOME EVERYBODY TO THE SECOND DISCUSSION IN THE THIRD STRAND OF THE NEW CLUB "R.O.C.K.S." - REWATCHING OLD CLASSIC KIDS SHOWS!
A big thanks to everyone that are joining us through all of this. It’s going to be an enjoyable ride!

This set of ROCKS discussions will focus on Superman: The Animated Series, and specifically this week, we're discussing the following episodes:

- Stolen Memories
- Speed Demons
- Identity Crisis

This show has been picked for us by Wilycub.

Just a friendly reminder to everyone that, whilst fans are obviously welcome to passionately discuss and give their views on these episodes, please remember to keep things on a friendly footing and respect your fellow posters.
Also, please do not post where or how to find the full episode online. And do not post asking others to PM it to you. You are however allowed to watch the show in whatever manner you want.

Stolen Memories was a really enjoyable. I liked the ending with the computer and the fortress of solitude. It was cool seeing Kal-El learn of and see his home world and parents.

Speed Demons was a fun episode. The Flash is a really fun character. I wonder how many more Justice League characters will make an appearance in Superman TAS.
A bit unrelated but I wonder if the Flash's red and yellow costume influenced the colour choice for Flash in Defenders of the Earth.

Identity Crisis was probably my favourite episode the bunch. Bizarro was a really well written character.

Stolen Memories
This episode introduces many important aspects of Superman. Firstly, we get to see more of Brainiac, his intentions and his abilities. It's enjoyable to see Luthor v Brainiac with each thinking that he is smarter than the other. Brainiac and his orbs are a very good tactic employed by the writers to enable Superman to learn more about Kryptonand the truth about Brainiac. I'm guessing the orbs were a homage to the crystals from "Superman" the movie.

Again we see more of Superman's limitations, as it is shown that he requires a spacecraft for deep space travel and that he cannot breathe in space. This in my opinion is a big "weakness" that the writers have given Superman. In previous incarnations, he was often shown being able to breathe in space. It also lends more weight to Jor-El's choice of Earth for his son. The episode also marks the first appearance of the "Fortress of Solitude", well it's site anyway. :)

Speed Demons
It's always intriguing to see Superman paired with/against another superhero. I doubt there's any character in the DC universe as entertaining as Flash! The interactions between the two super beings is probably the best part of the episode. The only thing that disappointed me about the episode was the villain and his "evil scheme". I'd rank the "Weather Wizard" quite low in my list of best cartoon villains. ;)

Identity Crisis
This is probably my favorite episode so far! The way Bizarro is introduced is just perfect writing. In the beginning, the viewers are left wondering who the real Superman is. Imagine if this same type of opening had been used for the ThunderCats episode "Spitting Image". It could have worked, but perhaps it might have been deemed a bit confusing back then. In the 80s, the cartoons were overly simplified for children. That's why most cartoons had a linear storyline with each scene being more or less fully explained before moving on to the next one.

I really feel for Bizarro. How he deteriorates from a smart handsome superhero into a dumb hideous beast. He is not evil at all, just not very bright. He is always trying to do good, but because he doesn't have the ability to think things through, he ends up causing more trouble than solving it. Bizarro is no doubt the Frankenstein's monster in the DC universe.

Bizarro's creation reminded me of "Superman IV", in which Luthor uses a strand of Superman's hair to extract his DNA and then create "Nuclear Man", or as Gene Hackman called him, "Nucular Man". :biggrin The episode again shows Superman's vulnerability, in that he can bleed. And like Jesse Ventura said in "Predator", "If it bleeds, we can kill it!"

"Wilycub, post: 118263, member: 25043" said:

I really feel for Bizarro. How he deteriorates from a smart handsome superhero into a dumb hideous beast. He is not evil at all, just not very bright. He is always trying to do good, but because he doesn't have the ability to think things through, he ends up causing more trouble than solving it. Bizarro is no doubt the Frankenstein's monster in the DC universe.

Bizarro's creation reminded me of "Superman IV", in which Luthor uses a strand of Superman's hair to extract his DNA and then create "Nuclear Man", or as Gene Hackman called him, "Nucular Man". :biggrin The episode again shows Superman's vulnerability, in that he can bleed. And like Jesse Ventura said in "Predator", "If it bleeds, we can kill it!"

I thought Solomon Grundy was DC's Frankenstein. ;) Grundy was a good character in the Justice League series.

Oddly enough I have never really watched Superman IV properly. I have seen it in parts so I have probably seen all of it but not all at once LOL.

We really need to watch 'Predator' in the movie thread. :D :rolleyes:

I was thinking if DC Collectibles expand their upcoming Superman TAS line beyond Superman and Louis like the Batman lines there is probably a few other figures they could do before they start concentrating on Justice League. Clark Kent, Lex Luthor, Brainiac, Lobo and maybe Bizarro.

Wilycub did you ever own any of the Kenner Superman TAS toys?

"Mark M, post: 118270, member: 5058" said:

I thought Solomon Grundy was DC's Frankenstein. ;) Grundy was a good character in the Justice League series.

If memory serves me right, I think Solomon Grundy was a human who was killed and then his body dumped in the swamp. The various flora and fauna of the swamp then brought him back to life by integrating themselves with his body, turning him into an almost invulnerable and super strong zombie. I felt Bizarro shares a lot more similarities with Frankenstein's monster than Solomon Grundy. ;)

"Mark M, post: 118270, member: 5058" said:

Oddly enough I have never really watched Superman IV properly. I have seen it in parts so I have probably seen all of it but not all at once LOL.

You should watch, but be sure to turn off your brain first! :biggrin It had potential to be a great Superman movie, but poor writing and a very low budget ruined it. It probably exists in the same universe as ThunderCats as humans can breathe and survive in space without even the slightest of discomfort! :laugh

"Mark M, post: 118270, member: 5058" said:

We really need to watch 'Predator' in the movie thread.

A million times, YESSSSSSS!!!!! I'm pretty sure I can quote the entire movie right now! :biggrin

"Mark M, post: 118270, member: 5058" said:

I was thinking if DC Collectibles expand their upcoming Superman TAS line beyond Superman and Louis like the Batman lines there is probably a few other figures they could do before they start concentrating on Justice League. Clark Kent, Lex Luthor, Brainiac, Lobo and maybe Bizarro.

Definitely. There are a lot of characters in Superman TAS that would make great action figures. Until you mentioned it now, I didn't know that the Superman TAS toyline was limited to just two figures. That is sad. :( Did DC make figures based on the Justice League Animated Series?

"Mark M, post: 118270, member: 5058" said:

Wilycub did you ever own any of the Kenner Superman TAS toys?

Unfortunately no. I have a small Batman TAS figure, which I got from a mixed lot of figures that my dad bought for me. I did however managed to snag on Ed McGuinness Superman figure. And you know how much I dig that line! ;)

So far the only Superman TAS figures announced and shown are Superman and Louis but hopefully more will be announced and shown at Toy Fair.
DC are planning on making Justice League figures. At SDCC they said it wasn't a matter on if it was just a matter of when.....and the general opinion is they will be on show at Toy Fair 2017.

I only ever seen the Kenner Superman TAS figures in a couple of shops in the mid 90's. I didn't get any at the time as I was quite into the Star Wars figures that were released at that time for the special edition re-releases of the original trilogy movies.

Bit late joining in on this one. I just saw the episodes last night.

Stolen Memories - I must admit I forgot at first that Superman didn't know who/what Brainiac was, and was wondering why he wasn't instantly pointing the finger! The way Luthor and Brainiac were each plotting against each other worked very well, as did the orbs - which enabled Superman to find out just how truly evil Brainiac was. If Krypton built him, then all those hundreds and thousands of worlds he destroyed must have all happened in a period of 20-30 years. Wow. That's some serious destruction. Brainiac is definitely mental. Agreed on Superman's not being able to breathe in space. I remember watching Lois & Clark 20yrs ago, and he was able to there, but it was a question mark, they did at least raise the issue of how long could he hold it for. Still, this is a bit more definitive on having him unable to.

Speed Demons - agreed again that the sparring between Superman and the Flash is hugely entertaining. Mark, I suspect the similar colouring between this Flash and Flash Gordon was coincidental, but did you notice that this Flash comes from a place named Central City? And that is the same as DotE. Although I'm guessing that DotE did the copying there. Also it was fun with the voices. The Flash was Charlie Schlatter, best known to me for playing Jesse Travis in Diagnosis Murder (which he was in at the same time as this), and the Weather Wizard was Miguel Ferrer - the Duelist if I recall correctly, and also a small part in Star Trek III: The Search For Spock. And the Australian tanker captain was Neil Ross - sounding very different from any of the voices I've heard him do before. Man, that guy is good.

Identity Crisis - what an episode! And yes, poor Bizarro. He really believed he was Superman. And yes, even the viewer is unsure at first. Because the two Supermen both believe themselves to be the genuine article, I was wondering first if this was some sort of time travel storyline. The Frankenstein's Monster influence on the character was very apparent very quickly, when his true face was revealed under the makeup - or whatever it was. The cloning was an intriguing prospect. Luthor's motives in particular, which I don't think were explained. Why was he making clones of Superman? To give the impression that he owned the hero?

All in all, three very enjoyable episodes. I said last week I'm not that into Superman in general, but I have been enjoying what I've seen of this show. I think there was a big push in the 1990s with certain characters to make them more "believable" - I remember hearing when they made The Legend Of Prince Valiant, they were very deliberate in making Merlin's doings non-magical, to make him simply a plausible 6th century sage who knew a thing or two about herbs and potions.

"LiamABC, post: 118306, member: 25438" said:

Identity Crisis - what an episode! And yes, poor Bizarro. He really believed he was Superman. And yes, even the viewer is unsure at first. Because the two Supermen both believe themselves to be the genuine article, I was wondering first if this was some sort of time travel storyline. The Frankenstein's Monster influence on the character was very apparent very quickly, when his true face was revealed under the makeup - or whatever it was. The cloning was an intriguing prospect. Luthor's motives in particular, which I don't think were explained. Why was he making clones of Superman? To give the impression that he owned the hero?.

Luthor is a great interesting villain which will see more of in Superman and Justice League.

"Mark M, post: 118333, member: 5058" said:

Luthor is a great interesting villain which will see more of in Superman and Justice League.

I absolutely LOVE this version of Luthor!! So you can imagine my anger/disappointment/shock when I saw Zack Snyder and Jessie Eisenberg absolutely destroy the character in "Batman vs Superman".

"Wilycub, post: 118338, member: 25043" said:

I absolutely LOVE this version of Luthor!! So you can imagine my anger/disappointment/shock when I saw Zack Snyder and Jessie Eisenberg absolutely destroy the character in "Batman vs Superman".

It's like Gene Hackman's Luthor in the Reeve moviesw. That Luthor was very smart and cunning but still comical and charismatic. The Animated Series Luthor was more closer to the comic. He was smart, cunning, charismatic, powerful and ruthless. Even what I remember of the Louis and Clark Luthor was that he was interesting.
The Eisenberg Luthor was a joke. Aside from not looking like the character he had none of the characteristics the others had.